My wacky Narnia theories

[epershand]

I have been generating large quantities of Narnia not-fic in my chats with oliviacirce today. Probably of particular interest to oliveoyl and tirial because GUYS I CAN'T RESPOND TO YOUR TWITTER CONVERSATION ON TWITTER, I HAVE TOO MANY WORDS.

WARNINGS FOR: CAPSLOCK, childhoods ruined
NOTE: I edited out just about all the parts of the conversation that were about The Magicians, but the following piece of the conversation is probably relevant to the kind of theories found below:

oliviacirce: D: I can't talk to most people about Narnia, though
or why I like it
despite (read: because of) everything that is WRONG
actually I feel like I could probably talk to Lev Grossman

epershand: Damn I love Edmund/Caspian, it is totally my Narnia OTP
I think the Edmund/Caspian fic I actually want though is, like, all from pre-dragon Eustace's POV D:

oliviacirce: Tommy was like, "…that wasn't in the book" and I was like, "YES IT IS WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT" and Chris was like, "LOL"
lol

yeah, I would read that
EUSTACE

epershand: EUSTACE
he is my FAVORITE
him and EDMUND

oliviacirce: yeah

epershand: but mostly when Edmund is BEING A SHIT
or SLASHY WITH CASPIAN

oliviacirce: yeah, I mean, that is when I like him too
I also like the Edmund/Caspian OH NOES WHO IS HIGH KING drama of Dawn Treader

epershand: The thing about my Edmund/Caspian is that in my head canon Edmund grew up and was successfully gay and had all these relationships with Centaurs and demi-gods and dryads in Narnia.
(heh, centaurs)

oliviacirce: YES

epershand: and then he went back to England and was pre-puberty AND then he got to witness the Turing trials all over the news

oliviacirce: poor Edmund
yeah, that totally sucks

epershand: so, now he's your standard tragic closeted English schoolboy except that he has memories of this whole adulthood where he was happy and out

oliviacirce: but I would totally believe it

epershand: so he gets back to narnia and he's like THE LAND WHERE I CAN BE GAY
and Caspian is totally pretty and pretty homoflexible, and he ADMIRES THE SHIT out of Edmund
and they're just ADMIRING THE SHIT out of each other all the time
and Caspian is like, let's share a bunk because I've given Lucy my cabin!
And Edmund is all OH OK.

oliviacirce:
TELL ME MORE

epershand: and then they are ROMANTIC AND SNUGGLY
and meanwhile there's Eustace, who is an annoying little shit
but whose annoying little shittitude is mostly about the fact that he's hilariously PC before his time

so I feel like at Eustace's Dreary Modern School there is a whole set of rules about how you should Respect Homosexuals and They Are People Too
(which, granted, means that given all the bullying at Eustace's Dreary Modern School, there are a lot of bullies who are like "I Respect You, Homo, You Are People Too" and then the kids are like "Um, I'm not gay." and they're like "WHY DON'T YOU RESPECT YOURSELF? NOW RESPECT MY FIST. HOMOPHOBE.")

oliviacirce: LOL
so true

epershand: So, Eustace is just ANNOYINGLY PC and condescending about the whole thing, while basically being really put out by the fact that LUCY is in her own cabin because she's a girl and the GENDERS are supposed to be EQUAL and EDMUND is getting ALL THE SNUGGLES and EVERYBODY HATES HIM)

oliviacirce: Aw Eustace

but then he TURNS INTO A DRAGON

epershand: YES

oliviacirce: so that is cool

epershand: I LOVE EUSTACE



epershand: I dunno, what I really want is lots of fic about the Pevensie children being Narnian in England
maybe the Chatwins can come too
Like, I want SO MUCH fic with them in the couple of years before The Last Battle
being their adult selves
OH QUESTION
I WONDER
What age they are when they chase the Questing Beast and go back to England
vs what age they are when they are in the train crash

oliviacirce: yeah, no, totally
right, because Narnian ages are weird too, aren't they?
how long DO they spend in Narnia as adults?

epershand: what if they're the SAME AGE

oliviacirce: HOW LONG IS THE GOLDEN AGE?

epershand: what if THEY ARE ONLY DESTINED TO LIVE AS LONG AS THEY WERE KINGS AND QUEENS IN NARNIA

oliviacirce: I would believe that!

epershand: they've always seemed a bit younger in the Last Battle than they were in the end of the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe though
so maybe, all told, they lived in Narnia for longer than they lived in England
that kind of turns a lot of my assumptions about their lives in England on their head
because the curse of Narnia is that when Aslan says they can't come back, it means that they have to live their full lives and grow old and die in England

oliviacirce: right

epershand: and the train crash means that, Susan aside, they get out of doing that

oliviacirce: yeah, that is weird
I mean, Susan is the only one that is really cursed


epershand: Oh man
What if Susan spends the rest of her life learning magic and becomes a hedge witch and spends the rest of her life trying to alter time to make the train crash not happen and ends up as Jadis?

oliviacirce: oooooh
that would amazing
it would even BE amazing
if only because Susan becoming Jadis is terrifying but somehow weirdly right

epershand: the thing about Susan becoming Jadis is that it does the opposite of solving the problem of Susan, it makes the problem of Susan 500 times worse
but at least it doesn't include graphic Jadis/Aslan, NEIL FUCKING GAIMAN

oliviacirce: no, I know
like, it's weirdly right, but the problem of Susan does become a billion times worse
ahahahah, well, yeah
OH NEIL

epershand: because then her series of consequences is
step ONE: like clothes and makeup
step TWO: get banished from Narnia for that
step THREE: become obsessed with getting back to Narnia
step FOUR: find a way to get to the world-between worlds but jump into the wrong pool
step FIVE: be worshiped, become vain and evil
step SIX: become immortal and vainer and eviler
step SEVEN: catch a ride back to the world between worlds on the coattail of the next available man, who is the professor who took care of you when you were small and pure
step EIGHT: ALWAYS WINTER AND NEVER CHRISTMAS, MOTHERFUCKERS

oliviacirce: IT IS TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE
and yet, I would believe it

epershand: and thus EVEN BETTER

oliviacirce: in the universe in which Narnia is BASICALLY EVIL

epershand: yeah

oliviacirce: cf, Fillory

epershand: yeah

oliviacirce: meanwhile I will be over here, chilling with Diggory
♥Diggory♥

epershand: &Diggory;
oh man and SUSAN EATS THE APPLE
and now she is EVERYTHING THAT IS WRONG WITH WOMANKIND and responsible for ALL SIN IN THE WORLD
all because she LIKED MAKEUP

Comments

[epershand]

Oooh, I'd love to read the story you're plotting. Below, Aria says that according to an official timeline I've never heard of before now, the Pevensies rule in Narnia for 14 years, and the train crash is 9 years later. I never really thought about the length of time before today, but I think I assumed that they ruled for ~20 years and that the train crash was about 15 years later, so I guess I assumed long on both counts. Interesting. That train wreck was the biggest Deus Ex Machina ever, sigh.

I actually haven't seen Dawn Treader either. My thoughts about Edmund were sparked by ivyblossom's really lovely Edmund/Bacchus fic years and years ago, and I've been plotting Dawn Treader-era Edmund/Caspian ever since. Ivy's fic is mostly about the nature of memory and the way that Narnia erases itself from the childrens' minds when they aren't there, but bits and pieces of it have stuck around with me and Edmund has just sort of become my personal queer character in Narnia ever since then. (Ivy's fic: Part One, Part Two, Part Three)

I think it would be possible to do Susan --> Jadis in a "fuck you" sort of way, or even along the lines of a fanwanky redemption of Lilith story, but my first thought is just to follow out all the potential negative consequences given that both of them start in a really problematic place. At bare minimum, that's a warning sign of what a positive feminist story needs to AVOID saying about the two of them.

Re: Neil Gaiman, his short story "The Problem of Susan" (in Fragile Things) is mostly really lovely, but the sex scene in it is HIGHLY TRAUMATIC.

[starlady]

I was assuming a short interval between TLWW and TLB, but I'm kind of angry that my short guess was right for the Golden Age. If I ever need to I am totally going to ignore that.

I clearly need to reread TVDT, since I think I missed the fact that Eustace is actually right except for his attitude. TVDT was my all-time favorite of the books for a while.

[epershand]

I'm pretty sure that Eustace isn't SUPPOSED to be right, I just have a hard time falling in line with Lewis when the evidence that he is being raised wrong is that his parents are "vegetarians, non-smokers and teetotallers" and have sent him to a coed boarding school.

[starlady]

I remember him being a pratt, but yeah, I think I disagree with Lewis here.

I kind of want a Jadis icon that says "ALWAYS WINTER & NEVER CHRISTMAS MOTHERFUCKERS."

Sex scene? Traumatic?

[(Anonymous)]

I don't remember a sex scene. What WAS traumatic was the body identification bit.